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HomeMy WebLinkAboutNatural Resources Advisory Board - Minutes - 09/02/1992MINUTES CITY OF FORT COLLINS NATURAL RESOURCES ADVISORY BOARD 281 N. COLLEGE AVE. - CONFERENCE ROOM SEPTEMBER 2, 1992 For Reference: Will Smith, NRAB Chair - 223-0425 Cathy Fromme, Council liaison - 223-9360 Tom Shoemaker, Staff liaison - 221-6263 Board Members Present Bill Miller, Phil Friedman, Terri Knudsen, Deni LaRue, Will Smith, Steve Erthal, Tim Johnson Board Members Absent (excused) Craig McGee, Hal Swope Staff Present Julie Bothwell, Edith Felchle, Randy Balok and Craig Foreman (Park Planning) Guests Present Jim Slagle (Public Service), Michelle Eccellente and Rex Burns (citizens) Minutes It was moved, seconded, and unanimously approved that the Minutes of the August 5, 1992 NRAB meeting be accepted as written. New Business Power Line Modification in Pineridge Open Space Craig Foreman and Randy Balok were present to discuss modifying the power lines in Pineridge Open Space. Balok stated that the City purchased Pineridge in 1976. There are other easements, but this one, in its current location bisects the property and crosses the reservoir. Public Service requested that the bisecting power line be abandoned and put in a new line to the edge of the property against the hillside. Foreman stated that Council asked for some dialogue and some Board discussion on the system. The "kicker" is that Public Service would charge $13,000 to underground the line, and if the City does not want to pay that, the existing line will stay in place. Foreman said in the near future the County will be working on some roads and they will need to readjust the lines and Public Service would be willing to work together then. Foreman presented a slide show of the existing power line and where the new lines would be. Jim Slagle of Public Service was also present. He presented a handout that showed the proposed type of construction; 40 ft. poles set 6 ft. in the ground so there would be a 34 ft. pole above the ground. An insulator 1 would be at the top, and. nen one insulator off on t_.e side. He said aesthetically these are a lot less offensive than the cross -arm structure Smith stated that the new line is above ground and what is being talked about is underground. Foreman said that undergrounding the line would cost the City $13,000, so right now it will be an overhead line with the vertical poles every 200 feet. Foreman said that the Parks and Recreation Board comments were as follows: (1) Staff asked if it makes sense to remove the section across Dixon Reservoir, and they responded, "yes" (2) The Board asked if overhead lines should be allowed at all in open space. Staff recommended not spending the $13,000 to underground the line. LaRue asked if it was possible that the whole area would be redone and the lines removed completely. Slagle answered that it is quite possible in the future. He talked with Mike Bryant, Larimer County, because one of the options that Slagle was looking at was extending the line down to County Road 42. The only problem is that the road is not scheduled to be improved for 2-5 years. They are talking about some big road cuts of 20 ft. and 10- 15 ft. of fill, so any work that would be done would have to be redone after the road was improved. Slagle did look at other options, but for the present this seems to be the most feasible route on an overhead basis; it also is the least costly and the cheapest to deal with in the future. LaRue asked if the City was to appropriate $13,000, would it come out of an open space fund. Foreman answered that it would come out of the conservation trust open space line item. Miller stated that it saves money for right now, and also the line across the reservoir is aesthetically more desirable at this time because it puts the line behind people. Erthal disagreed. He asked if it was going to be protected open space in the future and asked where it fits into the overall plan of open space. Slagle stated that it is City open space now and will remain City open space. Erthal stated that it is worth the cost of burying the line. Erthal asked what the cost of reclamation was. Slagle stated that he did not have any figures for that. Erthal felt that if they came to the Board with the $13,000 for burying the line, they should be able to come with the cost of reclaiming the 8 ft. scar. Slagle said the portion they looked at for the undergrounding was along the road and then along the old access road. The cost of reclamation of that portion is not much because there is not that much left. Erthal stated that it appears to him that they will be adding another 50% worth of visible power line compared to what was there before. He asked what the space between the new poles was vs. the old poles, and the height of the new poles vs. the old poles. Slagle stated that the distance across the City property is approximately 1200-1400 ft. and the distance along the County Road right of way and across the City is about 2500 ft. So in that area they are adding pole line, but the overall distance is close to a mile. Slagle stated the old poles were built on either a 35 ft. pole with an 8 or 10 inch cross arm on it, the double -pole structures on either side of the lake are on 40 ft. poles. He is proposing the new poles be 40 ft. poles, because the conductors are stacked and it takes a taller 2 pole, but at the same *me the stack configurations less visible than a cross arm. The standard space between poles is 200 ft. Foreman stated that with Rex Burn's development in the Foothills zone, Burns would have to deed some open space property to the City and do the low density "cluster housing." So when we look at the total area that people think of as open space, most extend it to the ridge, this area will become City land in the future. Felchle commented that Shoemaker stated from Staff's standpoint, Staff considers underground to have more negative environmental impact. Slagle stated that Rex Burns is committed to either doing this or finding an alternative route. Slagle said they do not have the money in their budget for an alternative route, so the line would remain overhead. Smith asked what happens to the easement if the new line of poles goes in. Foreman answered that the road would be vacated. Slagle stated that the only easement that is in there is a prescriptive rights easement; that line has been there more than IS years so they have the right to have it there and access and maintain it. Erthal asked if Foreman was asking for approval. Foreman stated that they are asking for two things. 1) A recommendation on getting rid of the line across Dixon Reservoir, 2) A recommendation on spending the $13,000 for undergrounding. Erthal recommended to table the item until staff lets the Board know why they think it is more environmentally sound to go with this option as opposed to undergrounding it. Johnson moved and LaRue seconded that the Board accept the recommendations of Staff. Friedman asked if it was conceivable that if the green line was undergrounded that it would only be a temporary fix. Slagle said if the line is overhead, they would revisit the whole issue when the road improvement is made. Larimer County has indicated that when they make these improvements they may ask for the line to be relocated or undergrounded. He said if it does go in as overhead it is not a dead issue, but it may not be that way forever because, at the same time they have a budget and if it is not economically feasible for them to relocate they won't. If it is undergrounded and it is decided to relocate or rework the entire distribution system they will leave it in place. Johnson stated that he made the motion for three reasons; 1) effectively removing the lines from about 2/3 of the open space, 2) it allows a future relocation, and if it is not done now, it may be impossible to relocate the line, and 3) it allows the option of changing in the future. LaRue said if in ten years nothing was done, would the City be interested, from the open space point of view, in relooking at it and seeing what undergrounding would cost. Foreman said it could get back in the budget a little easier at that point. The motion was passed 6-1. Erthal opposed because to him it makes a lot more sense for staff to come to the Board with concrete costs for 3 burying the cable, along kith reclamation costs. It —Roes not•make sense to him to add linear footage of new poles vs. old poles. Old Business Water Treatment Plant 11 Smith gave an update on the schedule of Water Treatment Plant 1 project. The first tour was August 29 and there were approximately 15 people present. There will be a meeting with Boardmembers, Mike Smith, and Suzanne Jarboe -Simpson on September 9, to review details for the September 16, meeting. The meeting will be at 5:30 p.m. in the Natural Resources Division's conference room. The second tour will be September 12. LaRue said evaluation forms were handed out at the tour and she received seven of them back. Miller will do the evaluations for the September 12 tour. A few people wrote on the evaluations that they do want something more formal, and would like to know more information. Smith said that Mayor Kirkpatrick apologized for not coming to the tour, but there was some misunderstanding of the meeting. Smith also said that Mayor Pro Tem Azari said that she looks forward to working with the Board. She will be out of town September 16, and will not be able to attend the meeting, but hopes there are many interesting participants. Final plans were discussed and made. Comments on Natural Areas Action Plan (NAPP) The Land Use Committee drafted a letter regarding the NAPP. Johnson stated that the main idea regarding the NAPP is that everyone is positive toward it. In the last paragraph of the letter there were a few comments about funding. The potential sources in addition to those noted in the NAPP are: 1) 0.25% city wide sales tax for five years, (November initiative), 2) lottery money from GO COLORADO, (state wide initiative), and 3) open space fee on new development implemented like the parkland fee. LaRue stated in the second paragraph, last sentence, it should read, "The natural areas should be managed for public benefit within the scope of natural areas preservation." In the fourth paragraph, the first sentence is not clear. Johnson said the purpose of the sentence was to be that the public natural areas and the private land holdings are going to be next to each other. He will rewrite it. Smith stated the reason funding is important is because a majority of the properties that have been identified for possible natural areas within the city are under private management. So he suggested putting something in the letter relative to that. Smith said relative to Legislative action one of the biggest impediments to some of this is water auqamentation considerations; without any legislative action then the city has to be scrambling for water auqamentation, and that is missing in the plan. Building a NAPP should be supported by some of the legislative actions and not be impeded by things occurring. He feels that there is a legislative aspect that is being overlooked in Section Six of the NAPP. Erthal moved and Johnson seconded that the letter be approved with the 4 f corrections stated. • C] Erthal would like for the Board to take a real proactive stance on pushing for increasing funds. Knudsen asked if City-wide sales tax was public common knowledge. Johnson said that it was at present; Council voted on it September 1 to officially put it on the ballot. The motion was passed unanimously. Old Business Natural Areas Funding Johnson said that for 1993 there is approximately $185,000 recommended in the budget for natural areas funding, the last two years Council has put in $200,000 each year. A few years ago the Board recommended to Council establishment of a 1.5 million dollar fund for natural areas funding. He feels that while they have some potential with regard to the letter 1993 is the year they cannot let slip, and recommend that Council do much better than the $185,000 the City Manager is recommending. Felchle clarified that the City Manager is recommending $200,000. Johnson suggests that the Board should ask for $500,000. If Shoemaker begins to make progress with the Seven Springs area everything in the pot could disappear. Smith asked if it would be possible to update the letter that was presented to Council last year, detailing some of the properties with figures and recommending a level of funding, then sending it forward for this year. Johnson moved and Knudsen seconded that the Board update the 1992 letter and set the level at $500,000 for funding. Erthal moved to amend the amount to $750,000. The amendment was accepted. The motion was unanimously approved. Smith will rewrite the letter with the corrections of the NAPP and include the proposal for funding of natural areas. Moratorium on Shake Shingles Erthal stated that what spawned this was there are a few architectural review boards in Fort Collins in certain subdivisions that require the use of Cedar Shake Shingles. There are alternatives available, he feels that it is appropriate to prohibit these shingles. These shingles are also a fire hazard. The use of cedar shake shingle does more than cut down cedar trees; it encourages the use of the shingles over and over and the average life of the shingles is 10 years. Basically what the review boards are saying is, "We are basing it on esthetics, but not functional use." Erthal stated that there are several alternatives, and they are at a reasonable cost. There are even some insurance agencies that will give lower premiums 5 because of non -cedar shak. shingles. Erthal presents some examples of alternative shingles. Johnson asked where the cedar was coming from for the shingles. Erthal stated that the information is not available to him. Smith asked how Erthal sees the process flowing through the system; what information does Erthal have on the ordinances that he would like to show as models. Erthal would like to see a moratorium and could model after several counties around the country that have put a ban on the shingles. Johnson asked if some counties in California have done this, would it be possible to identify them and write a letter asking them for their reasons for the ban. LaRue said that it seems like the Board could, as a part of their charge, recommend to Council to adopt it for the City as a City policy and then recommend it to residents and builders. Erthal stated that would be a good first step. He would like to see City staff involved in identifying some of the ordinances and identifying where some of the materials come from. Felchle stated that Shoemaker's preference would be for the Board not to make a decision at this meeting. He would like to be part of the discussion. Smith said that there are good reasons to pursue it, but there also seems to be a lot of ground work that has to be done. it is just unclear who would have the time to follow up on the existing ground work. Johnson stated that there are times when the Board initiates things on their own, and he suggested that Erthal find out the counties and have them send the ordinances and the reasons why, then come back to the Board with the reasons why those counties have adopted the ordinances. That would put the Board on a much firmer ground for making a recommendation in the future. Erthal asked staff to spend some time on it. Johnson recommended that Erthal help out by giving a "jump start." Knudsen stated the Minneapolis building industry is pushing the concrete shingles as one of their alternatives. Erthal moved and Friedman seconded that the Board ask Staff to provide limited research and revisit it at the October 7 meeting. Smith stated, for clarification the Board can make recommendations to Council, Staff would hear the recommendation, but the Board cannot direct staff. Felchle agreed stating that the Board can make the motion, but it does not mean it necessarily will happen. Smith asked if it necessarily has to be the Natural Resources Division, if one of the potential benefits is reduction in fire hazard is it possible to ask Council to have Poudre Fire Authority (PFA) look at it as an issue. Erthal stated that PFA does have a lot of information 0 I available on it. • 0 Erthal stated that PFA had tried to put a ban on cedar shake shingles a few years ago and was unsuccessful because there was not a pleasing alternative. Smith suggested the Board table the motion and Warren Jones be asked to come to the October 7 meeting, and direct more specific questions as to some of the things that may help out. Erthal withdrew the motion with Friedman seconding. Update on Environmental Fair Felchle stated that the Environmental Fair is September 19, at Library Park. One of the unique things about the fair is that it is government sponsored, but it is cooperative in that exhibitors include government, non-profit and business. This year there are also some financial sponsors. There are currently 47 exhibits, but she expects more to come in. This year with "Balance of Choices", the NRD booth will address the "choices" aspect from the standpoint of 1) identifying the fact that the selection committee does not screen exhibitors; 2) having a general kind of handout with "thought -starter" kinds of questions to get people into the habit of asking various kinds of questions relative to their actions, decisions, and purchases in real life relative to the environmental impacts. Part of that will address evaluating environmental product claims. Felchle stated that the one need she did have was that the Natural Resources booth, in addition to the choices aspect, will have two other tables: a recycling table and the wheel of environment, which means the booth needs to have two people staffing it at all times. She asked if some Boardmembers could volunteer for a couple of hours. Smith said he could possibly help out. Committee Reports (UnscheduleM Smith stated that members should have, or will be, receiving a letter from Rick Ensdorff regarding a review of the Northeast Area Transportation Study on September 10. Ensdorff has also been asked to be on the agenda for the October 7 meeting. Smith stated that it was that time of the year again for end of the year committee reports and what is planned for the following year. He would like for the committee chairs to put together a draft of what was done in the last year. Announcements Felchle announced that the Urban Wildlife Exhibit, which has been touring Colorado, is at the Fort Collins Museum. It is from July to the end of November. The Museum is inviting the Natural Resources staff over for a special viewing September 9, at 2:30 p.m. and the Board is welcome to attend also. Smith strongly recommended that the Board participate in the Boards 7 and Commissions Workshop. It is scheduled for Septet ar 30, early evening. Agendas, along with the time that it will start will be mailed at a later date. Friedman handed out some copies of articles from "AMICUS" magazine that he thought the Board would be interested in reading. Smith stated that there were copies of the fall issue of "Environmental News." He also had copies of the C-41s September/October newsletter. Miller stated that in the August 30 issue of Fort Collins Time there was an article on the parking situation at Fort Collins High School. Smith announced that C-4 has information on cost of maintenance, and cost of building, per parking space at CSU and the number of spaces. There is consideration of writing a soap box article illustrating those costs. Adiournseat The meeting was adjourned at 9:00 p.m. 8